Dr. Eckert Podcast Episode 70 - Not Sleeping? - CBT-I with Kasryn Kapp [Full Transcript]
I had such a great time talking with Dr. Eckert! Below you’re find a video preview and the full transcript
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Podcast Episode Transcrpit
Dr. Eckert: [00:00:00] This is Dr. Kate Eckert with the Form, Function and Flow Lab podcast. I'm a chiropractor, yoga instructor, anatomy junkie, and movement educator, and I am looking forward to exposing you to all sorts of ways that you can prehab your body to avoid injury and maintain those hobbies, activities, sports that you love to do. And we'll also be focusing a lot on the pregnant and postpartum journey and making sure that you can return to those activities that you love or even keep doing them while you're pregnant.
Dr. Eckert: All right, so this is Dr. Kate and I am here today with Ryn Kapp and she is actually from my area. So I've met her in my hometown and she has moved on to Philadelphia and is doing really cool things in the therapy space, and I'll let her introduce, [00:01:00] herself
Kasryn Kapp: Hi, thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited to be on the podcast. Um, so like you said, I am in the therapy space, mental health therapy. I'm a licensed professional counselor in the state of Pennsylvania, so I can see folks all across Pennsylvania on telehealth. One of the cool things about mental health therapy is that it's a low touch field, So, it pairs really well with, uh, virtual telehealth.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, and I have a, a couple of different specialties. I work with insomnia: trouble sleeping, waking up too early, waking up in the night, that kinda thing. Uh, LGBTQ folks either with disabilities or chronic illness or some sort of body mind difference. So maybe low vision, hearing loss, that kind of thing.
Dr. Eckert: Nice.
Dr. Eckert: [00:02:00] And um, you also do the, uh, sign language as well, Correct? With your, with your clients if
Dr. Eckert: they need it?
Kasryn Kapp: What was that?
Dr. Eckert: Do you also do sign language with your clients if needed.
Kasryn Kapp: That's right.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah. Yeah. So I'm conversational in American sign language. Um, so I would refer out if anybody is absolutely fluent native sign language user.
Kasryn Kapp: But a lot of folks, um, grew up using it a little bit and also speaking and listening. So yes. Yes as well. Thanks for, uh, bringing. Yeah.
Dr. Eckert: Nice. And I think a lot of times with, I know for myself, since I am not in, I'm not in the therapist space, you know, people think of counselors and therapists and we kind of get muddied with like what your credentials are.
Dr. Eckert: But as I was reading through your bio, you have a long list of summa cu laude graduations from, you know, you have your masters, you have your bachelor's, and all of those things. So, um, in, you know, I know there are bunches of different, uh, certifications that people can have to counsel people. So do you wanna give like a brief, like what your venue is and how you got certified with different things.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, that's a great question. And you are so right. It, it does get confusing and sometimes people use the word therapist when they're not a therapist. Um, like particularly in the finance space, I see people saying like, I'm a financial therapist, but they're not. So it's licensed at the state level. So in Pennsylvania, you're a licensed professional counselor, a clinical social worker, or a marriage and family therapist.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, you could also be a [00:04:00] psychologist, so that's a whole different thing. The other folks can use the word therapist. And um, in order to do that in Pennsylvania, you have to complete an undergraduate degree in psychology, social work, marriage and family therapy. And then a master's degree as well as 3000 hours of supervised experience.
Kasryn Kapp:So , it's quite a lot.
Dr. Eckert: Yeah.
Kasryn Kapp: Quite a lot of, uh, supervised experience and, um, and then can be licensed in the state of Pennsylvania. So all of that coursework has to be related to counseling, um, and social work. So, um, I've taken statistics, counseling, strategies, theory, all of this kind of stuff. And then every year we have to do 30, 30 hours of continuing education. So, um, we need to be staying up on the latest [00:05:00] information. So, um, yeah, just the background of being a therapist and all of that, you. You need to do, and you can always ask folks if you're interested in starting work with someone. You can ask them “what are your credentials?”
Kasryn Kapp: And um, they're really required to bring that up as well. So you should be able to see on the website or on some other, um, yeah, some other part of their office. Their credentials.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm. .
Dr. Eckert: Yeah. Cause I feel like in today's day and age with social media and everything, you see lots of people who put their out there and say that they're a therapist.
Dr. Eckert: But I don't necessarily think that they're by any means a license by the state kind of therapist with all of the schooling behind it. I think people just use that, Right. And just put a word before, like sex therapist or food therapist or, you know what I mean? It, it can be mm-hmm. really, I think it devalues [00:06:00] the word when you put so many 3000 extra hours past your masters into it,
Kasryn Kapp: Right, right.
Kasryn Kapp: There's a lot of, um, coaching, like life coaching. Um, I think that I see that more and more, and. It's really important to be careful because you can get into big trouble for putting therapists next to your name if you don't have that. Um, qualification. There's other therapists too, like physical therapy, massage therapy, but if we're talking about mental health therapists, um, yeah, you wanna make sure you have that.
Kasryn Kapp: But I see that that's, uh, popcorn therapist. I dunno, put that and sometimes it's to be silly. Yeah.
Dr. Eckert: Yes. Well, the first thing that Ryn and I had touched on was her work with, um, uh, insomnia and for myself and my patients, that is, was like really peaked my interest [00:07:00] because. From the physical aspect of people's health, I can't get people fully healed if they're not getting adequate sleep.
Dr. Eckert: That's when we rest, that's when we restore, That's when we have, you know, our growth hormone works. That's all these different physiological things happen when we're sleeping to make you heal. And if you're not getting it, It's gonna be a huge stumbling block. So, and I'm not good at getting people better sleep.
Dr. Eckert: I mean it pain wise, if they're not sleeping because of pain, that can be helpful. But a lot of times pain, they've had it chronically, then it becomes, uh, like a mental barrier too, because it. It becomes a totally all consuming thing of their day, and it gives them anxiety, it gives them, you know, depression, all sorts of things.
Dr. Eckert: So if you wanna talk about your, um, CBT-I [00:08:00] stuff
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You're so right. It has such a huge impact on our lives, the quality and quantity of our sleep, um, and treating sleep. Can impact so many areas. If you can improve your sleep, it can help with depression. There's a lot of research on that. It can help with all of the, the healing work that you're talking about.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, it can really, um, unblock a lot of, uh, issues and let them heal on their own. So, yeah, I love CBT-I because it's evidence-based. Even if you just Google C like the letter CBT-I, um, it shows up with a ton of research, um, that shows how effective it is. So that's what gets me excited about it. Cause I love to see results.
Kasryn Kapp: I've run a group before, uh, for it and just, it was [00:09:00] amazing seeing folks sleep better for the first time in a long time. Uh, and I'm running a group again. I'm excited about that. But one of the things that can come up, uh, is usually there's a precipitating event, having a kid, um, having surgery, having some kind of chronic pain, maybe a shift work, you have to work overnight. And then there's the perpetuating factors. So we try to catch up on sleep, go to bed earlier. Um, all these sorts of things work in the short term, but in the long term they can create insomnia. So, um, a lot of what C B T I does is kind of undoing the, um, perpetuating factors.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm.
Kasryn Kapp: and I can talk about some quick tips, but if you have had insomnia for a couple of months, it might take more than just a few quick tips.
Dr. Eckert: Definitely, and I [00:10:00] feel like most of my patients have struggled with it for years. And you know, I always ask people if they're hurting, getting good sleep, cause it's really important for what I do.
Dr. Eckert: But a lot of times they just blow me off and say, Oh, I'm just a bad sleeper. I've been a bad sleeper for years. And they just kind of have it. And I don't think PCPs are equipped to deal with it either. And they tell their pcp, but really they only have the resource of medication. To help with it.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah.
Kasryn Kapp: Right. Yeah. It, it can become, it can take on a life of its own. If, if, if you find insomnia that falls into a pattern. Uh, so I try to go to bed. It's like two hours to go to sleep, so I go to bed two hours ahead of when I think I'll fall asleep, and then I wake up about 1:00 AM. And I'm having a glass of water, and then about two hours later I have to go to the bathroom
Kasryn Kapp: Um, if it has a pattern like that, that's a [00:11:00] really good sign that it's, um, treatable because it's falling into this pattern where our brains are used to this sleep pattern and it's, it's, um, you can do something called sleep restriction and stimulus control to push the sleep back into a quality efficient sleep.
Kasryn Kapp: And then increase the quantity once you improve the quality, So what's happening is your brain's used to the routine of, Okay, I'm gonna go to bed and then I'm gonna lie awake and think about what I have to do tomorrow and what I forgot to do today. And all these scenarios , and then I go to sleep and then it's time to wake up for water.
Kasryn Kapp: Mm-hmm. , uh, we get into these routines. Um, another way to think about it, we just had the time change the daylight savings time and a lot of people, it'll mess us up because, not because the clock is wrong because a lot of our smartphone and Fitbits and all is wrong update [00:12:00] automatically. But because our internal clock doesn't just change like that, we get onto a routine.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm.
Kasryn Kapp: And so what CBT-I does is it helps you reset your clock. To oversimplify it, to helps you reset your clock in depending it works for you where you're getting quality sleep at the quantity you need.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm.
Kasryn Kapp: that, that was a lot, but hopefully
Dr. Eckert: that makes sense. That makes sense. And that kind of, um, I got into meditation a year ago and that's kind of how they see the meditation is, it's a condensed period of really quality, deep rest that is better than just, you know, non quality, longer periods of resting, like with white noise and all the other stuff be going on [00:13:00] around you.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah. Yeah. I love that. And one of the, one of the things that people I think worry about when we talk about, um, treating sleep maybe, uh, a barrier is if, if the time that you're lying in bed awake is your me time, if it's the time that you're on your phone, if it's the time that you read, um, it can be really hard to give that up.
Kasryn Kapp: Or if you're snoozing time in the morning is your me time. Um, yeah, I, I would, I wouldn't wanna give that up. I'd say "this is how it is and this is how I sleep". But what I like to emphasize is we're not, uh, taking anything away. It's great to rest in the morning. It's great to rest at night. Um, so yeah, we're not taking anything away, but that can be a barrier sometimes.
Kasryn Kapp: Mm-hmm. Yeah. And so [00:14:00] now on your website I saw that you had like C B T versus C B T I, and I know you do the CBT-I. So what is the difference between those two?
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, that's a great point. I'm glad you brought that up. So CBT cognitive behavioral therapy is a modality of therapy. Um, and that's also very evidence-based..
Kasryn Kapp: So if there's a big umbrella of cognitive behavior therapy, CBT-I is under it. But we're talking about sleep science in CBT-I. We're talking about, uh, sleep prescription, stimulus control. We're talking about really focusing on the sleep, and then a little bit of thought, uh, cognitive restructuring or changing your thoughts.
Kasryn Kapp: The broader CBT is, uh, your thoughts, feelings, and behaviors, looking at how they interact [00:15:00] and, um, how you can change your thoughts to change your feelings and your behaviors. So a quick, easy example, what does that all mean? Uh, a quick, easy example is if you're in the grocery store and you see somebody that you know and you wave to them and they have a weird look on their face and keep walking. There's a couple different thoughts you could have to that. One is they hate my guts and I'm actually terrible. And something I said six months ago must have made them mad, uh, you could think, okay, they must not have seen me at all. They must be in their own head, um, thinking about their grocery list.
Kasryn Kapp: And they remembered something, which was the, the facial expression. So the first thought of, they hate me, you're gonna feel like a lot of negative, uncomfortable feelings and um, and probably maybe avoid the person, maybe [00:16:00] to confront them. It's gonna affect your behavior versus, okay, they must have not seen me or had something on their mind.
Kasryn Kapp: You could probably feel a little bit lighter and it probably won't be any wanting to confront them or anything like that. So that's CBT is thinking about things in a different way. Um, and some folks have had a bad experience with CBT where they feel, um, it can be kind of invalidating if, let's say you are victimized by somebody and it's, it's real, but you're trying to think about it in a different way. But there's still, um, there's still. I don't know what to call it. Victimization going on. They're still harassing you. Mm-hmm. , CBT is, not for that. CBT would not be a helpful intervention there that some people have had experience with it in that way. So I like to [00:17:00] clarify with CBT-I, we're talking about sleep, sleep science. We do a little bit of changing our thoughts, so what that looks like for sleep is: If I go to sleep right now, I'll get exactly four hours of sleep and if I stay up one minute later, then that's one more minute more exhausted I'll be tomorrow. Um, that sort of thinking is less helpful than we're humans. We sometimes get horrible night sleep and we survive it and you know, I'm working on improving my sleep.
Kasryn Kapp: And it's gonna take a little bit of time. That thought is gonna be more helpful. So that's the CBT of sleep, but it's, it's not, um, a hundred percent that I'd say maybe five to 10% CBT of CBT-I So it's confusing because they share a name.
Dr. Eckert: Yeah, no, that makes sense. And that's something, this isn't on the sleep end of things, but um, some of my [00:18:00] patients that have tried therapy. I get the common response that they say it's not for them and I, I say it's like probably like chiropractic. You probably just haven't found the right type or the right provider for you. You know, there are tons of different techniques and therapies out there for chiropractors and PTs to use and um, that one type of treatment might simply not have worked for you, or you just didn't mesh well with your provider. That doesn't mean the whole profession is entirety has failed you. And I think definitely. So. Yeah.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah. I'm so glad you brought that up. I had that a little bit with chiropractors. Um, yeah, there's different modalities, different treatments, different style um, and there's a lot of different types of mental health therapy. [00:19:00] Um, it might be helpful if you feel like it wasn't for you, um, something you could try. Cause I know it can be intimidating to start with a new therapist and you don't know what really went wrong with the last one or what to look for.
Kasryn Kapp: Starting with somebody new can be really intimidating. Um, so something that might be helpful in that case is to learn about therapy modalities. So, um, some examples of some stuff you could look up and see if it feels like a good fit. Um, you could take a look at internal family system, ifs, EMDR um, eye movement desensitization and reprocessing.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, you could look at CBT, you could look at DBT D as in dog BT,
Kasryn Kapp: um, and just take a look at them and see if one really clicks. It might feel, [00:20:00] um, like a better modality. You could try with a different therapist with that.
Dr. Eckert: Now, for, I saw that you have the, the group CBT-I but then also the individual. When you do. I'm guessing when you do the group, it's like we're talking about only sleep here. And then when you do the individual, do you draw in some other, um, therapy type things into their visits?
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, that's a great question. So if somebody's coming in and they're only presenting concern is sleep, That's it. No depression, no anxiety. No family tension. Um, I would do pure CBT, but I'd say CBT-I (I'm sorry).
Kasryn Kapp: But I would say that's really rare. Most of the time we have something else going on. A little bit of depression, anxiety, family stress, [00:21:00] existential dread , most of the time there's something else going on. So in that case, in the individual, we can weave it in, um, and use other modalities. Um, in order to get the holistic picture. With the group, you're right, we are talking a hundred percent about sleep and with that you can have an individual therapist who's either somebody. For me to work on the other stuff, or for the folks that just have sleep and that's it. Um, you can just do the group by itself.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm. . That's it. So that's interesting. So your group program would also be relevant for people that already have a therapist that they like, and they could do this as well. It's at the same time.
Kasryn Kapp: That's right. Yeah. And when I ran the group before, uh, my colleagues who referred their clients to the group said, Wow, we finally had that [00:22:00] breakthrough with the depression . , or, you know, finally things, Oh, it's starting to move forward because the sleep issue is addressed. So it's, uh, a six to eight week program, CBT-I, and unlikely that a therapist who's working with depression is gonna focus a hundred percent on sleep for two months because there's other things to, to look at, but you can have that breakthrough elsewhere.
Kasryn Kapp: So, yeah, I've had, um, that feedback from, from colleagues about, Finally making some progress. Cause the sleep is addressed,
Dr. Eckert: So this, the group program is six to eight weeks, or it's eight weeks. Right. And then is it, how long are your sessions each week?
Kasryn Kapp: So it's 60 minutes weekly and I run it for eight weeks. I like to give a little bit of more time.
Kasryn Kapp: You can do it in six, but I like to have a little more time to [00:23:00] work things out. Um, and yeah, it's an hour and then you're doing a little bit of homework. Of course you're gonna track your sleep every night, what time you got into bed, what time you tried to go to sleep, how long it took you to go to sleep, and so on.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, so we can track your sleep efficiency. And it's really cool to see because it, it tends to, for the first two weeks, it's really frustrating. We're basically setting up the baseline, how things are now. But then over the next several weeks, it's really great to see the progress improve on this week's diary.
Kasryn Kapp: And the other thing with CBT-I is that it tends to last a really long time. So, um, you're gonna learn a lot of skills that you can keep forever with sleep medication, a lot of times it, it wears off or you build a tolerance to it, it doesn't work as well, [00:24:00] whereas the CBT-I is really getting to the root of the problem.
Kasryn Kapp: And so you're likely to see long lasting effects. So it's not like you're gonna have to do the CBT-I group every couple years or, um, you know, every, however often. It tends to be really effective and last a long time.
Dr. Eckert: Nice. Well, that's pretty cool. And then, um, I don't know, I didn't see this on your, I, I think I did see. You have your prices on your website for it. Yeah. And the,
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah.
Dr. Eckert: You do like a, That's per group session, right? Yeah,
Kasryn Kapp: so it's $53 per group. So the group session and then the individual is just my regular individual rate, which is on the website.
Dr. Eckert: Nice. And then people can use their health savings accounts for [00:25:00] that?
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You can use your FSA HSA. Um, I don't take insurance. Some insurance companies allow, um, out of network benefits, so you'd have to ask them if that's something they do. Um, but I'm not in network with any insurance companies. Do you, do
Dr. Eckert: you provide like, um, The C P T and ICD 10 codes, like for people to like submit a claim to their insurance company if they wanted to.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah. Mm-hmm. , I can provide super bills Yeah. With the, with that information on it.
Dr. Eckert: So, And with your licensure, you work with, specifically with people in Pennsylvania, but anywhere in
Kasryn Kapp: That's correct. Okay. Yeah, it is by state. So, um, they're actually looking at, um, doing a reciprocity agreement with other [00:26:00] states. Psychologists are able to do this now where there's 26 states who made an agreement that if you're licensed in one of these twenty-six states, then you can see clients anywhere. Um, because again, we are a low touch, um, field, We don't need to. We, we talk to you, we do assessments, we do all sorts of things to test where you're at, but none of it requires touching your person. So we're very well adapted for virtual, but, uh, yes, but for licensed professional counselors. So me, I'm just in Pennsylvania, so anyone in Pennsylvania. I would be able to work with you. If not, uh, if you're listening to this and you're outside of Pennsylvania, you can find a CBT-I provider.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, there's a directory. Um, if you just Google CBT-I directory, there's a list of people who, who do CBT-I [00:27:00] if you're interested in it.
Dr. Eckert: I didn't think to ask what made you get the CBT-I training.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, that's a great question. So I was in college and I had the worst sleep ever. I did not sleep and then I would sleep during the day, which is a problem because I am trying to take classes.
Kasryn Kapp: And it was, it was, it was kind of hilarious. I was drinking coffee at like 9:30 at night, terrible sleep. So, uh, so I went to the counseling center at my school. And that was part of the issue I came in with time was like, God, I can't sleep. It's stressing me out. And my therapist at the school counseling center told me about CBT-I and we did some CBT-I stuff. Next thing you know, I'm sleeping through the night. It was like a miracle. It changed my life and uh, [00:28:00] and ever since then, it really does last a long time. So. We all email. I'm on my phone at night. I slip up a little bit, but as soon as I implement the strategies again, I sleep well. So yeah, it came from a very personal place.
Kasryn Kapp: I'm naturally not a good sleeper, but CBT-I helped me a lot.
Kasryn Kapp: Awesome. Now, in your individual sessions, like when, if you're not dealing, if you're just doing. Your work with your regular clients, patients, um, what techniques do you use with them?
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, I tend to take a person centered approach, relational. So, um, and I do get a little bit of CBT-I when it's, um, when it's a good fit for it. Uh, CBT, I'm sorry, and , CBT-I but what it looks like is, We are so social, we're so [00:29:00] connected to other people, but in our society and our culture today, it's so easy to be very disconnected and to not really, um, understand how to have a deep connection with other people. So I'll do a lot of boundary work.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, I think boundaries are a way of showing someone you care about. That might sound radical, but if you're taking the time to communicate your needs to someone that's really powerful. So boundary work relationships, um, it's kind of hard to describe in a quick way like this, but basically how you feel about yourself, how you feel about and connect with other people and how you feel about and connect with your environment.
Kasryn Kapp: We're gonna look at all those pieces in sort of a holistic way.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm. . Okay. [00:30:00] That sounds kind of like how I practice with the body in my practice too, so,
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah. The holistic.
Dr. Eckert: Yeah. Right.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah. It's hard to describe it because for, it's so individual, for each person. Um, the work that you do, I would imagine is really tailored to the person.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm. , definitely. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, it's good to have different tools in your toolbox because not every patient is so different and, you know, if you try something and like with those patients, Go one time to therapy and they're like, It's not for me.
Dr. Eckert: Well, your therapist might have many other tools in their toolbox that you need to try out, cuz maybe that might work for you better. You know? So like, yeah, making that clear, I guess, while they're in it so that they're not like writing it off [00:31:00] immediately. For sure.
Kasryn Kapp: Definitely. Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Eckert: And then the last thing I saw on your website and we had talked about earlier was that you work with different healing specialists to, um, work on being better, serving an all-inclusive community, whether it be the, um, you, you can describe it, but I, I thought that was very interesting because. Um, it just helps us get a better idea of how to make everyone feel comfortable in our offices.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, definitely. So I love talking about inclusivity and accessibility specifically with LGBTQ and folks with disabilities so, um, so those are my two other specialty areas. So a couple tips for providers how to help clients [00:32:00] LGBTQ and clients with disabilities feel more included:
Kasryn Kapp: so for LGBTQ, um, there's a couple of main highlights. One is not assuming that somebody is straight. So if you see somebody come in and say, Oh, how's your husband? that is gonna be a signal like, Okay, this person's assuming I'm straight. Am I the first? If I come out to them, is it gonna be a whole thing? Uh, so just you could ask open ended questions like, Oh, are you seeing anybody right now?
Kasryn Kapp: Or just not assuming.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, and then, uh, pronouns is another big one. I see a live, uh, talk about this. So if you don't know what a pronoun is, if I'm not in the room, you would say, Oh, she talked about this. It's the way that you speak about somebody else and you don't use the name. So, um, asking pronouns can [00:33:00] be a helpful way to be inclusive.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, cuz we never know what somebody, what their gender is. You can't really tell by looking at someone.
Kasryn Kapp: Um, and then for folks with disabilities, um, having an accessible office is kind of the one that most people think. Wheelchair accessible. Um, but also asking before if you're doing something with movement or, um, or touch, asking someone if they can do something, um, before they do it.
Kasryn Kapp: For example, if they need to sit on the floor asking them, is that something that you have a lot of pain doing? Is that something you're comfortable doing? That can be helpful as well. And, um, I work a lot with the virtual space, digital accessibility. There's a, [00:34:00] um, I did a blog about it, but for virtual accessibility, making sure that, um, things have captions closed captions and, um, That those screen leaders, that a screen leader can read them.
Kasryn Kapp: So somebody who's blind or low vision, they would use a device that reads it for them. Um, and that can kind of all feel overwhelming. I, I get that feedback, feedback a lot, but oh my gosh, I dunno what to do. . Mm-hmm. so stressful. But just taking it one thing at a time and just little by little improving over time. Yeah, it can be helpful.
Dr. Eckert: I think that there's been a lot of, as I've gone through, I, I started doing more, uh, online stuff and the exercises online, that kind of thing. When the pandemic hit, cuz I don't sit still very well and I had a month off [00:35:00] and. I've noticed that there are a ton of, uh, free apps. Like I use the Captions app and it will transcribe things for me up for free, up for up till three minutes.
Dr. Eckert: So that works well with those shorter things that I do, whether it be on YouTube or. TikTok, those kind of things. And um, so that's really nice that they've come out with those really affordable options and you can edit yourself and that kind of thing because it can be pretty labor intensive to do on your own.
Dr. Eckert: Um,
Dr. Eckert: yeah. Yeah. So I have seen some things. It's the longer stuff that is harder to get, get in there because transcription back in the day when I started to have someone have your stuff was expensive, but
Kasryn Kapp: yeah. Yeah. I think there's some platforms, um, [00:36:00] that allow you to do it. Uh, we're getting really advanced with speech to text and text to speech. The technology is rocket shipping, , that's not a word. It's advancing. Um, so there's a lot of ways to, um, to do that, that are just coming out now, um, with one is called Descript that I'm gonna take a look at and use.
Dr. Eckert: Yeah, and I had used one when I first started that I paid for that did do longer ones. I just remembered this after we had talked called Zub titles, Z U B titles and it, it will do longer ones for you, but you have to like sign up for so many transcriptions per whatever monthly period.
Kasryn Kapp: Mm-hmm. . Yeah. That's great. Yeah. One other thing too that can be helpful, [00:37:00] um, is to ask if folks need accommodations, is there anything you need just putting the norm for that. Mm-hmm. . Um, and it can be really hard as, uh, Solo practitioner, you're in private practice, but even setting aside a really small amount of the budget for accommodations, um, that can be helpful to do as well. Um, it doesn't have to be a lot and most accommodations don't cost anything. Mm-hmm. just an adjustment.
Dr. Eckert: Well, actually, we. This isn't an accommodation, but we just switched, um, software. It's like our note taking software and it just populated itself and has a space for what your pronouns are.
Kasryn Kapp: So yeah, that's perfect. Yeah. That's so great. A lot of of folks [00:38:00] really benefit from that. Um, The impact of using someone's correct pronouns on their mental health is phenomenal. And the impact of misgendering someone is devastating. Um, so yeah, it makes a huge difference. And if somebody just uses the pronouns that you would assume, then you just have those pronouns in there. It doesn't, it doesn't hurt anything.
Dr. Eckert: Mm-hmm. , Yeah, I, yeah. And a lot of times in the software we had before, it wasn't very customizable. You just get what you get it, you know, sends it out. You can't edit things. And um, so for this new software, I see that they're making change. It's a newer company you can make, you can edit things if you want to.
Dr. Eckert: It puts stuff like that in there automatically.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, yeah, yeah. The technology more and more is, is moving in that direction to make it [00:39:00] sort of seamless, including pronouns. Um, telehealth platforms are including captions more and more often. Um, yeah, it's really moving in that direction, which is great.
Kasryn Kapp: Definitely.
Dr. Eckert: Awesome. Well, I will put Ryn's uh, website info below, um, in description and if you have any questions or if you'd like to reach out to her to work with her, I'm gonna make her info available at the office because I think that getting more sleep is going to benefit my patients and everybody, uh, and if you, I feel like group, the group setting seems less scary, less, you know, you know, one on one seems to be a little more frightening to people at first. So yeah, usually have, sometimes have people [00:40:00] start with the group setting and be like, Okay, maybe I have some other things that I need to address, and then go on and do other kind of therapy after.
Kasryn Kapp: Yeah, yeah, definitely. It can take the edge off, It can ease into it and the CBT-I group, it sort of feels like you're taking a sleep class. So if, if it helpful to think about it, if it feels a little less scary that way, Like, I'm taking a sleep class and there's homework and everything. So, um, yeah, and I adapt it to all levels. So if a lot of the terms I use are really confusing, don't worry. We break it all down. I won't overwhelm you with technical jargon, but you will leave much more knowledgeable about sleep and how to get a better night's.
Dr. Eckert: Awesome.
Dr. Eckert: Alrighty, well thank you so much and let me know if anyone has any questions for Ryn
Dr. Eckert: okay, [00:41:00] awesome.
Kasryn Kapp: Thank you so much for having me.
Dr. Eckert: I look forward to working with you guys and if you have any topics that you'd like discuss to make sure to comment below and let me know cause I'd be happy to share all the knowledge that I have on those issues.